Sammy Volkov is a classic tale

ep36 – Sammy Volkov is a classic tale

[00:00:00] I don’t know why I am so overly interested in common threads. Maybe it indicates a storyteller personality, which kind of aligns with a lot of my career path and interests. I get deeply hooked at a story’s ability to create multiple points of interest and then cleverly stitch them back together. I remember walking out of the movie theater in Scottsdale, Arizona after watching Paul Thomas Anderson’s Magnolia like I had just seen God.

While my companions all complained about the three hour runtime, I love a good callback. It makes comedy more funny when it’s also smart and clever. It absolutely kills in songwriting when clever threads are sewn in. Not by generic, repetitive choruses, but a bridge that can tie a bow on a nugget dropped in each verse or concept album even better.

I started writing songs in my head, trying to be clever with common threads before I even [00:01:00] knew how to make music. Something we discussed in common with Sammy Volkov, an old soul, well-traveled singer-songwriter based out of Edmonton and Portland. Ironically. When a storyteller starts spilling their own story, they let humility gloss over common threads.

What is really interesting about someone, how did they arrive to this point? What happened at each stop along the way? If you can find a thread, however thin. Go with it. Maybe that’s a lesson or a pro tip. I don’t know. But when all the details and filler of a life are thrown down on a page or up on a screen, we all just kind of want to get to the magic that connected the dots.

Sammy Volkov almost missed the magic, but we found it a young person looking for the chance to be something more than just what they are good at. Or even told what they should do [00:02:00] and chasing it around the biggest centers in dramatic fashion, internally workshopping a life that externally was not yet realized until it found its time.

Sammy has settled back from the big city charms of New York, LA, and Toronto to the real charm of Edmonton and Portland to audaciously abandon the obvious opportunities for personal workshop. Of a career in music releasing a sophomore album just last week. Songs from The Goodbye Garden, Sammy Volkov, fearlessly Blends AM Radio Era Voices with Hi-Fi genre blending arrangements and modern lo-fi indie charm weaving common threads through eras of inspiration with audacious self-assurance.

In that voice. My name is Glen Erickson. This is Almost Famous Enough. Thanks for spending your time with us. This is Sammy Volkov.

[00:03:00]

Glen Erickson: Happy to. This is great. I appreciate you, um, taking the time for this, Sammy. I know you’re right around the corner from releasing an album, so I mean, that’s something to obviously talk about, uh, right off the bat, but, you know, that’s tends to be, you know, a lot of things going on, but I’m, I’m sure very much the focal point of, uh, your time and, and energies right now.

So there’s different places I like to jump in with people. I don’t, um, I don’t always just, uh, focus on the latest record type thing. I’m often interested in sort of how you got to where you are right now with what the latest record is. But let’s start for a second with the latest record. So you, March 5th is the release.

State that I think I saw. So that’s right around the corner, uh, like at the end of this week and of when we’re recording at least, and, songs from The Goodbye Garden, technically your second [00:04:00] full solo record, we can talk about some of the other stuff that you’ve been working on. But here’s where I, I wanna know right off the bat, Sammy, like a couple things.

Um, ’cause I’m always interested in how the industry keeps changing, right? And, um, so my curiosity immediately lands like, if, if we were to run into each other somewhere and just you started telling me you have a new record out, my first question might be along the lines of, like what do you do these days to promote a record like it used to be?

So, it, I mean it was just so prescribed for so long through my growing up and through a lot of years, and not only has like the digital transformation kind of threw it on its head over the last. 15, 20 years, but even I think the last five, six years of the change in the media landscape on every layer has changed so much.

So I’m just curious from your perspective as a younger person, you know, just kinda getting into this world of like, how do I do this? Like how do you get [00:05:00] into the promotion of a new record these days? What are you doing?

Sammy Volkov: Uh, I wish I knew.

Glen Erickson: Well, you have a publicist. That’s a good start.

Sammy Volkov: yeah, I got, uh, Jason Schneider to help me out. in the past I had worked with Jason more kind of formally, like from the first single through to the albums release. This time I just did the three singles by myself, myself and, uh, brought him on board much later to try and help me with kind of opening some doors and, you know, getting some access to people who may listen to the record and help kind of, you know, spread the word about it.

Um, what I’ve been doing is just sort of trying to stay in touch. People I admire musically and follow their lead. So, you know, one person who I always look to as an example is, uh, Muriel Buckley, really ad admire their music and, uh, you know, she’s just killing it. yeah. How to, how to promote an album.

I don’t even really know. I mean, I do [00:06:00] try to do what I see people doing and like, but it doesn’t really, it doesn’t really give me any peace of mind. Um,

Glen Erickson: Well, let me ask you a question. Let me jump in because you, you sort of said a thing there that I find is interesting, Sam, which is, you know, the, the idea that you. Are emulating people that are around you that would inspire you and, and, and you’re referring to more accessible people, right? Like people that you’ve probably either shared stages with at different shows or ran into at different music events or, you know, so people that you’ve got to hear their music, you, you admire their music or their performance and also met them personally and discover they’re not an asshole and they seem to know what they’re doing or, uh, and the reason I jump on that point, which I think is interesting because, yeah, I think so often artists and as artists, we talk about, you know, when we first get started and what [00:07:00] inspires us to start making records or writing songs and then making records, you know, and that always comes before the business, right?

Like the inspiration and the art comes before the business. And, and the emulation is often part of that conversation. Like, who inspired you? Who are you, who is your north star? Like, whose career would you want to be like, or, or things like that. But that’s a very different conversation than like, who,

Sammy Volkov: Yes. Yeah.

Glen Erickson: am I looking at people to know how they do the business of music?

Right. So I find that really interesting that you sort of stated like, you know, like you’re looking around to see like how do they do it? And I think that’s a real accurate part that a lot of people don’t always realize. I mean, let me ask you this as well, ’cause I’ve, I’ve seen like you’ve got a lot of great players that have played with you, people from the local scene that are very well known as very good players and have played in a lot of, you know, very good bands and made a lot of good music coming out of, uh, Edmonton and [00:08:00] Alberta in general.

how did you get to the point where you form those relationships? How did you sort of find your way into being? I don’t know what level of like either like just using them or whether they become friends and they’re a part of, you know, the circles that you run in. How did, how did you kind of get to that point of, you know, being what, on the outside appears to be pretty good at forming relationships with the right people?

Sammy Volkov: Yeah. Uh, well, I’m glad it looks that way. so the people who played on this new album, um, yeah, they’re like, you know, best of the best and, uh, they have become my friends too. And some of ’em are my friends going into it, which is kind of the best thing ever. If you can work on a project and you’re, and you’re working with your friends, like, you know, that’s a dream.

And, uh, but I think a lot of these people I met through going to shows in Edmonton and, uh, [00:09:00] I saw them playing in bands and I, I just really liked what they were doing. and when it came to the production of the album, like the recording, what happened with that one was actually I went to Blackbird Music here in Edmondson on, uh, on White Ave.

And I got the latest, uh, face Healer album. And, uh, I played the record and, and right away I said to my partner like, well, I gotta ask, Randy Wilson, to, to produce this album. And I, I only say that ’cause I think it’s sort of a good example of how my brain works. It’s like I, I see or hear someone, I like what they’re doing and I just kind of have the audacity to ask ’em if they wanna work with me.

And more often than not, they do.

Glen Erickson: yeah. So are you, like, do you, have you, audacity is a great word. it’s. Have you, are you an extroverted person? Do you consider yourself an extrovert person? A charismatic person is like, historically, is that an easy, that’s not an easy thing for you to, to do, or sort of a natural, because you hear about these people and you know, they’re [00:10:00] like, yeah.

Their parents would be like, yeah. They were always just like a little hustler going around the street doing stuff like,

Sammy Volkov: no. Not at all. No, I, I think I’m pretty hopeless socially actually. Um, I feel like I’m getting worse and, uh, I guess what it is that gives me that confidence is that I feel like the only thing I’m really good at is, is singing and, and sometimes writing. And so, like, I’ve spent my whole life just totally burying myself in music I love. So I feel like that’s kind of where I almost have a bit of, if not authority, just confidence. Like I can, I can approach someone and I, and I know where I’m coming from and I feel like I know how to present myself in that context in a way that I might win them over, you know? Or at least you could have like an understanding.

So, you know, that’s when I feel more relaxed with people. If I get to talk about music, that’s maybe the only time I’m really relaxed

Glen Erickson: Mm. Yeah. And so that kind of pulls a little more outta you when it comes to all of that. Yeah. I mean, ’cause it’s not very [00:11:00] easy to make those relationships. Like I know in my story when I was like, okay, I want some of this stuff to happen. It’s, it’s very, very similar right, is I was playing with people and some of my friends playing with a couple of different bands and I.

And they weren’t the go-getters. And I wanted more shows. And, you know, I started asking and I sort of just figured out that there were like three guys that seemed to book most of the venues at that time around the city, and that I needed to go just sit around on bar stools and hang out and get to know these guys and sit at shows and, and all that kind of stuff.

And, um, and you’re right there is that, that, um, for lack of a better term, audacity to just be willing to put yourself out there, you know, and, and see what comes of it. Um, you, so you referenced a bit about growing up. I, I, I like doing this. I, I like going back and finding out how you got to where you’re, and especially ’cause we don’t know each other.

Like, I, I sometimes have people on that I’ve got long [00:12:00] relationships with and maybe know more of the story. Obviously it’s a podcast. It’s not just for me, it’s for other people’s benefit too. Um, but so take me back. I’m curious about your upbringing. I’m curious about sort of how you found your path into music and who you are.

I’m curious about where I saw you listed as Portland slash Edmonton artist a number of times. So I’m curious about this connection. So, um, maybe take me back to like sort of where you kind of grew up in your foundational, uh, you know, era of, uh, how music sort of introduced itself. Like whether you had a musical family or the place you were in.

Where did all this kind of begin for you, Sammy?

Sammy Volkov: off. Well, I always think about it as being here in Edmonton. so, so right now I’m in my parents’ home and, uh, I live in Portland as well, so I, I was sort of like a, a barnacle on the ship of my, uh, my partner’s career. And so she’s doing her postdoc [00:13:00] in Portland, Oregon. And, uh, you know, we just decided that I could go to, and I, I, uh, I’m a dual citizen and so is she.

So it was very lucky. Like we, we didn’t know that obviously when we met, but um, it’s just turned out that that made it okay for us to travel together. And that’s, uh, beginning to prove, to be like quite a boon, for my, my career. ’cause I can play in the US and Canada and, um, not worry about visas and stuff, which is a huge, huge impediment I know for a lot of

Glen Erickson: Yeah, they did. Really? Yeah.

Sammy Volkov: um, but anyway, all that said, uh, yeah, so it’s a whole beginning of like. My brain being warped by music and like, you know, specifically old music becoming like, all I ever thought about as a young person, would just be, um, I think from the radio. So I remember hearing the radio when I was really little, and then my parents got me like a little windup radio and like AM radio was still used.

And I would listen to like the oldies channel, I’d put the radio under my [00:14:00] pillow and I think it like broke my brain because I was like training myself even when I was sleeping to sort of think in those ways. So like, I, a lot of my music sounds sort of retro, but I don’t really consciously do that at all.

Like, it, it’s not, always like I’m necessarily aware of trying to, You know, copy someone. But, um, that’s just like actually how my brain works. And uh, but then in Edmonton I would just kind of, um, being as socially useless as I am, I would spend like all my free time going to garage sales and like flea markets and thrift stores and stuff and uh, like antique malls.

And some of my favorite memories would be like

Glen Erickson: Which Edmonton has plenty of. Yeah,

Sammy Volkov: yeah, Edmonton is great for that. I would get the, my parents have the newspaper and I’d go to the classified section and, and circle places that, you know, people had said they had a garage sale and if they had records, I had a map, I’d circle their [00:15:00] address on the map and I’d go off on my bike and bike all day to get to some like weird garage in a suburb. And my favorite memory was I went to this suburb and garage and this super cool old lady was there and I wish I had spoken to her more. I don’t know anything about her except I think she said she was in a band, which is so badass. ’cause she was. 73. And I, I told her I loved records. I think I was like 12 or 13 or maybe up to 14.

And, um, she said, well, they weren’t for sale, but I’ve got a box of records back in the garage there, like under this sheet. And she pulled them out and it was this incredible box of like, beautiful, early to mid fifties, r and b and like a doo and rock. And, um, I think she could see that I was like a kindred spirit.

So she kind of just let me have them, you know, for, I don’t know, 20 bucks or something for like a box of these beautiful records. And so that was like a fundamental moment in my life. It wasn’t [00:16:00] just the music and the magic of the records, but it was also making this kind of cool connection. And yeah, these records were just like an amazing escape.

I could like create my own world, you know? And uh, that was my favorite thing. It became my favorite thing. It’s still pretty much is my favorite thing.

Glen Erickson: So you were

Sammy Volkov: of who I am.

Glen Erickson: Yeah. You were 13 or 14, so, so she probably was actually 53. You just thought she was 73. Because I’ve always, I, I look back all the time and I think I remember thinking how old I thought, um, some people were when I, I’m just kidding. But, um,

Sammy Volkov: No, it’s, it’s totally true.

Glen Erickson: that’s, uh, yeah, that’s really formative. So, so that music influence was really sort of, of your own, I guess, your, your own pursuit, right?

Like, you just, like, it just, you kind of got exposed and you just, I mean, I really like, I like that a lot, Sam. It feels so, uh. It feels so [00:17:00] natural and not forced, right? It’s not like my parents made me start taking piano when I was five and, and I had to, you know, these different, there’s, and they’re all valid, they’re different stories that people have.

Um, but there’s sort this sort of sense that, that just your natural spirit just followed this thing that got introduced to your life and you couldn’t help yourself. Um, which is pretty great. So you, you already, you already tipped off that like your love of music from certain era in a sense. Um, which like, I’m sure that this ends up being a part of every conversation you ever have to have in media or press or even just regular folks at shows and stuff who are, everyone gets fascinated when a young person attaches themself quite a bit to what we would consider more era defined genre or things.

Um. So talk a bit more. I’m, I’m very curious about how that continued to develop in you at such a young age. [00:18:00] Because in its own way that’s extremely counterculture, um,

Sammy Volkov: Nice.

Glen Erickson: continue to sort of allow, and like you said, I think, right, that it’s not like you were trying hard to emulate or recreate a thing.

It’s just what out? Um, which I can totally understand. Like, if you get shaped by a love of, and you don’t even know it, you know it now that you are actually being shaped by song structure. When you think that you’re just being shaped by a melody, you know, they, they get tied together and, and somehow when you start making your own music, you know, you end up knowing that that’s the box.

I know how to put this thing inside of. Um, so how did that start coming out for you? At what point did I should say at what point, right, like when do you start, I don’t know whether you started with singing or whether you had to start learning some instruments to kinda help you bring this stuff out. How did that start to.

For you.

Sammy Volkov: Well, I started, uh, coming up with melodies and, and even writing down some words when I was like seven or something. And I [00:19:00] remember it was a secret, like I hid it in my room and one time. My mom found like a, a little page. I had written a song on it and I think I was seven. And it went, uh, Peggy Sue, I always wanna be with you.

I know. I love Will be so true. Whoa, whoa, Peggy Sue. So it was like, I was seven and I was already writing like, you know, 1957 Weird, like rip off, rip off Buddy Holly stuff. Um, but so I was already doing it and I don’t really know why. So I hadn’t seen anyone do it or been encouraged to do it. And I was like embarrassed about it.

Like, I remember it was found, I was like really, really embarrassed. And so, but I kept doing, I would always make up little songs in my head. And then, uh, I went to an acting school as, you know, jumped a bunch of years and, um, at that, uh, school, you know, we were working on clays and scripts and all that stuff, but I found the only thing I was really connecting with deeply would [00:20:00] be anytime there was music and, uh. That school kind of taught me to, uh, well, it, it taught me a lot of things, but the most important thing it taught me is that it’s like okay to have, uh, faith in your own ideas, you know? So that was the first time where I thought, well, maybe these little songs I come up with, I could write them down and not be so embarrassed.

And, you know, ideally I could write them down with some chords and then I could make some little voice memos of myself strumming guitar along with the words and, and the music. And again, I had no reason to do it. Like, I don’t know why I did it. Um, if anything, it was sort of like a, a distraction, like when I should have been focusing on plays and auditioning and stuff.

I never did that ever. Like, I would never spend my time reading a play. I’d go home and listen to records and then, and write songs and try to go to open mics and stuff. So that was pretty telling. But I still stuck with this four year program. And then by the time I finished it, [00:21:00] uh. I just, I felt pretty lost.

And the only thing I had that I was sort of proud of, you know, I had like eight songs or something, maybe some of them were like half songs. Um, but I moved to California and I had an agent there and, uh, I was working as a door-to-door salesman for a green piece. Every day I would drive to a different part of LA County and I’d have a map and I’d have to go to every door.

And it was just exhausting. But what was cool is that it gave me tons of time in a car to listen to music and come up with songs. And each day I’d, I’d pick an artist to focus on and then I’d go home and very consciously tried to write a song in that style. So I would pick like we pierce and then go home and try to write a fifties country song.

And then I’d pick Joni Mitchell and try to do a Joni Mitchell song. And then Jackson Brown try to do a Jackson Brown song. And. Um, Solomon Bur and Bobby Blueland and, [00:22:00] uh, all these weird kind of disparate sources. And, um, it was, uh, sort of like a school, you know, I had just finished doing acting school and now I went home and would focus on music in this kind of structured way.

And, uh, anyway, it’s kinda a long-winded answer, but what I’m trying to get at is that like, that was the time where I really started to very seriously work on writing music. And that was in like 2015.

Glen Erickson: Yeah. And that’s very intentional emulation. I think everybody starts trying to emulate something like we had talked about before, that inspires them. And it, and it happens in different ways. That’s a very intentional way to choose to do it. Like, I’m gonna try to write specifically this style song or this kind of thing and see if I can do it and figure it out.

But we gotta back up. ’cause you, like you said, like you moved to California and then you’re selling for Greenpeace in [00:23:00] LA County and, and I, so I’m like, okay, wait, wait, wait. Like how old are you when you’re moving to la? ’cause the last time check I had when you were 13 or 14 and you’re, you know, with the 73-year-old woman in a garage alley, and then you’re moving to California with Greenpeace, like, are you a young man?

Did your family move? Did you move by yourself? What was, what was this, uh, this big move?

Sammy Volkov: well, so I, so I went to that acting program in New York, ’cause uh, I could do it as a,

Glen Erickson: okay. New York too. Okay. We gotta add this in too. So we’re New York.

Sammy Volkov: yeah. ’cause it, so in high school I had a teacher who encouraged me to do acting, which was, which was great. But what’s, you know what’s actually funny is that. I only went down that path because I sang a song in class one day, and it was the first time I ever sang in front of anyone was in high school.

Glen Erickson: Hmm.

Sammy Volkov: everyone really liked it. And the teacher was like, oh, that was [00:24:00] actually really good. Like, you could do that. And uh, I thought, you know, they’re just being nice, but it’s kind of fun. Like I, I do like this music a lot. And, uh, what it was was a, a short clay about zombies. And I decided that there could be like a moment in the show where I, my zombie character sings up to, uh, a woman in a balcony.

And, uh, it was, it’s too soon to know, which is like a jazz standard. And I just changed the words around, I don’t remember that. But it was about being a zombie and that we could be in love. So, you know, that got me into like high school plays and stuff. Which I didn’t enjoy. I, I loved, I loved the people around me and I loved that teacher.

And, but it was like, I didn’t really like being in those shows. I didn’t like working on ’em that much, but before I knew it, that meant I was like auditioning for acting programs. And because I’m a dual, a Canadian, US citizen, I could audition for American programs more easily [00:25:00] and you know, seriously consider them.

And, uh, anyway, so I wound up going to one in New York that was, uh, the state University of New York at purchased college, which in 2010 was considered like one of the best acting schools. And it also happened to be a state school, so it wasn’t like that. Um, unbelievably crazy expensive like, uh, you know, NYU or something.

Um, and um, and that’s not to say I paid for it. I’m super, super privileged. You know, my parents paid for all that. And, uh, so went that school, that was very mixed. I left that school. There was again. It’s kind of an audition kind of thing we would do for industry people. And so I got an agent from that in LA and I later an agent in Toronto.

And so I really thought like it was all gonna work out. And I was auditioning and this guy in LA who turned out to be a real sleaze bag, and I was so naive, I didn’t, I couldn’t see this, but

Glen Erickson: Hmm.

Sammy Volkov: he, he [00:26:00] literally said to me, uh, like, I think you’ve got upswing potential. You should just move out to LA and we’ll, you’ll be busy.

I’ll, I’ll set up meetings for you. It’s gonna be great. And so I actually took him at his word and, and moved to LA and, uh, it was a disaster. And I, I was just there being a total, I just was a total familiar, you know, like classic as, as cliched as you can possibly be. Like this young, bright-eyed kid moves out to California to be a star and got nowhere at all.

Glen Erickson: that’s a story that’s out there already. It’s true.

Sammy Volkov: Yeah, it’s like the most. Cliched story. Uh, so what happened was I got this crappy room in a, in a kind of crappy house, and, um, it’s actually a cool old house, an eagle rock. It was like a really, really old, cool house, but it was tiny, and my room was tiny. So to pay rent, I got a job, uh, with Greenpeace, I was, I was applying to be a dishwasher at a diner.

This, it’s weird, this all sounds like some really corny, [00:27:00] like fifties story and maybe because of all the old crap I always put, er, you know? Yeah. It’s like that’s how I chose to make my life this corny story. But I was applying at a diner in Eagle Rock to be a dishwasher. And while I was getting the, uh, manager, my resume, there was someone sitting at the bar, like the diner bar thing, having a milkshake.

And they overheard me begging for a job. And they came up to me and they said, Hey, I work for Greenpeace and I think you could be, uh, a canvasser. You could a door to like subscription, see for Greenpeace. So I wound up doing that and um, yeah, that’s like the, as quickly as I can tell that

Glen Erickson: So, I mean, I mean that requires, I mean, I find that interesting, Sammy, because what you’re basically telling me is that somebody overheard you exercising the audacity to beg for a job and said you would do well at door to door, which requires audacity, which you’ve always said isn’t your natural go-to.

[00:28:00] Um, but you know how to somehow summon it. Um, I think that’s a pretty interesting thread. I also just love that I had to just stop you. I could have not stopped you and then unpacked like NYU or not NYU, New York and acting school and LA in a sleazy manager in a and a diner. Like, you’re right, like all of this is fantastic story, but also just the fact that like, man, the path that people go to be at a place.

Um, and in music, all you ever see is the presentation of the songs and the assumptions you make about the person that’s embodying those songs, if you’re a listener, uh, are just so full of assumption and just very, almost like one dimensional, right? Like, and, and so you don’t see these kinds of things, which is why the conversations are always so much more interesting.

Um. You know, and the avenue through theater and your own sort of self-awareness that [00:29:00] like, yeah, the thread was always music. Like, I thought it was acting, I thought it was theater maybe, or whatever version, but you know, it only happened because I sang a song inside of a play. You know, all these kinds of things.

Um, so, so by this point you said like, that takes you up to like 2015, um, and you’re, you’re looking at a choice, I’m guessing by that point about what you wanna do with your life and your, in la So how did that turn its way? Did that turn its way back to music back to Canada right away at that point, or?

Sammy Volkov: Yeah. So I guess I had nothing but choice ’cause you know, nothing was happening. And uh, I just think what happened was, I think I went from LA to Toronto because yeah, that through the LA thing. I got in contact with a Toronto agent and then they told me the [00:30:00] same story and said, well, come to Toronto and you’ll be really busy and you, you’ll kill it out here.

Just come to Toronto. ’cause you know, this is a reputable agency and you’ll do great. And so I went to Toronto and the same thing happened where, um, you know, I did audition and this, I liked this agent a lot. He was a nice guy. He was not sleazy, but it just wasn’t working. You know, like, it, it doesn’t throw a lot of people.

Uh, for most people in acting. And, um, then I just started working in restaurants and, uh, you know, it’s pretty boring story I guess to me, but like, it, it was just Toronto, you know, LA Toronto, New York, Toronto, Edmonton, New York, Edmonton, Toronto, New York. I think that’s actually what happened. It was that many moves and it was always trying to chase where I could maybe get acting stuff to happen.

And all the while, all all, I was really truly applying myself in, uh, with like my whole heart was, uh, continuing to write music and, and sing. And, um, so by [00:31:00] 2018 I found myself back in New York and through a friend of a friend, I got a job with Zero experience. Um, and this is not about me being audacious, it’s just about someone being nice and they, they like threw me a bone and they got me a, a job.

Very last minute as an assistant to a, a prop master for a TV show. And, uh, the previous assistant to the prop master had had a mental breakdown. And so they were really desperate to find someone stupid enough to come in and clean up this mess that the previous assistant had made. And so I’m sure what happened was anyone in the industry didn’t wanna come in and do this ’cause it wasn’t worth their time and energy to, to not only work on all the stuff coming in every day, but to go back in time for like, two seasons of a TV show and clean up all the mistakes someone had made.

So, but they knew [00:32:00] I’d be willing to do pretty much anything. So I came in and I, I did that job. It was really stressful. Um, but again, it was cool because I was living in Jersey City with my brother for a bit. ’cause it was, we found a really cheap thing. And then I would take the train, many trains from Jersey City. Into Manhattan, through to Brooklyn and then far, far, far east into Deep East And uh, that was about two and a half hours of commuting every day. And that was awesome time for writing because I found the trains were like an ideal environment for focusing and writing. It’s like white noise and you can literally sing and talk out loud without really scaring people too badly.

’cause they’re used to crazy people doing that all the time. And there’s so much noise that doesn’t really matter. So it was a perfect place to listen to music and to write music. And then I go back to my apartment and really flesh out these ideas I had. Um, so by [00:33:00] 2018, uh, into 19. I was working like crazy.

And I think what it was was, yeah, 2018, at one point I was back in Edmonton and I made a EP with stuff, just the four songs. And then, yeah, a year and a half or so, or two years after that, at this point, I had made my way into accounting for TV shows, which is completely insane because I literally didn’t finish high school math.

And for whatever reason they decided I was qualified and I was suddenly making pretty good money. Um, like I was living very comfortably and saving money like fast. And so I hated my life and I was so bored sitting at this desk, counting up lunch receipts and deciding like whose sandwiches could be reimbursed or not.

Glen Erickson: Yeah.

Sammy Volkov: And I just picked up my phone and I was like, this is insane. I can’t do this anymore. And I wrote to Scott Francia and Harry Greg here at Edmonton at Riverdale Recorders, and I said, like. I hate my [00:34:00] life. All I do is write music and go to open mics. I need to do this. I don’t care if it’s a vanity project ’cause it’s all I wanna do.

I have a bunch of money I saved from working in accounting, which is horrible. What will it cost to make an album? And they were like, of course we’ll do it. So I came back to Edmonton, started recording. We did like two songs and then as you know, early 2020, the whole world fell

Glen Erickson: Yeah. Yeah.

Sammy Volkov: And so, uh, uh, it’s such a douchey thing to say, but it was kind of lucky for me because I was pretty lost anyway and it kind of forced me to totally reset. And all I had going on were these songs and this money I had saved to make an album with Scott and Harry in Edmonton. And because of the times, everyone had a bunch of free time, they didn’t wanna have, so suddenly all of these great musicians were free to come into the studio safely. And work on my stuff.

And so, you know, [00:35:00] we had the time and, and the resources to do that. So that was my first album. And then from doing that first album, uh, thank god I didn’t look back, you know, I, I didn’t, I didn’t go, okay, that was fun. Let me go back to LA or

Glen Erickson: done. Yeah.

Sammy Volkov: it was like, yeah, yeah, no more, no more nonsense, no more wasting time, no more ego and no more trying to please everyone else.

Like I, I finally thought, you know, who cares? It, it’s just none of this matters. Um, we’re all gonna die soon, so I’m just gonna work on what makes me happy.

Glen Erickson: Yeah.

Sammy Volkov: And yeah, so for, from, from then till now, I’ve just been steadily working on this, uh, on doing, on doing what I really love. So, yeah.

Glen Erickson: well, I mean, there’s so much in there, Sammy. That’s, that’s really, uh, it’s really fun. I, what’s fun to me is, uh, you made a reference before about, this is sort of like an old script of some sorts, but it’s like there’s a number of eras of [00:36:00] script. Like while you talk, like the diner was a very specific, uh, visual picture.

And again, like, because we’re so informed from movies, from Hollywood, um. But even you just describing like, I ended up on a subway for, on a train for two and a half hours. Well, how, how immortalized is the picture of the, kind of the tortured young person sitting on the, the long subway rides in New York City, do you know what I mean?

Amongst a bunch of crazies, but somehow, you know, comfortable in that chaos. Um, it, it’s a, it’s just quite an idolized, uh, concept in, in film. Um, so it’s really easy to picture what, yeah, it’s been romanticized, so it’s, it’s very easy to picture what you’re talking about. Um, I am very interested though about, because you just kind of said like, I was done with pleasing others and, and it had crossed my brain when you said, and you started saying like, you know, [00:37:00] really the path was probably like to New York, Edmonton to New York, to LA to Toronto, back to New York, maybe back to Toronto, back to la.

And anyway, like so often a big part of. The artist pursuit. Um, and everybody comes to their point of honesty at different places. Uh, as a precursor to this is, is that big pursuit is like, we’re just driven by this thing about validation. And it’s, and it’s a mixed bag. I mean, it’s, it’s the validation just of our own inner voice,

Sammy Volkov: Yeah, totally.

Glen Erickson: in, in very much truth.

Like we’re trying to get to a point where the inner voice is saying like, that was good. Like, what you’re doing is good. You’re really like, or you belong, but you’re also in a lot of different ways. And I, I’m not qualified obviously, to be the psychoanalyst, but I think, you know, we. We blend and mix, or at least take into another compartment the external validation of people.

So [00:38:00] when we’re young, it’s similar to what you were describing is like maybe all it took was somebody we didn’t know was sleazy saying, if you come here, you’ll be busy. And how many people have followed their dream? You know, like you said, like in a very cliche, again, another sort of romanticized storyline, you know, whether it’s coyote ugly or some other version where somebody chases their, their way to a version of like, if you come to this place only, or if you’re in the same area as these people, something will happen for you.

And when all you want is for that thing to happen. And if anybody, and it starts with a lot of us sometimes. Is why I like to ask people about their family and their upbringing, and sometimes it’s just like how strong the voice of your family is that tells you you’re great. You’re gonna be great. You should do this.

Or, or maybe you don’t have it there and it’s somebody externally the first time they tell you you’re actually really good. That’s all it takes for you to chase a career path. Right. Um, and so bouncing so many places in so many ways, which feels like you were just [00:39:00] taking every opportunity of somebody telling you that maybe there’s something for you here

Sammy Volkov: yeah.

Glen Erickson: to landing it up.

Yeah. To landing at a place where you say, like, I needed to say, like, I’m not doing this for anybody else anymore. Um, was that like a big sort of revelation moment that came outta making the record? Like the, the achievement of the record itself? That first one.

Sammy Volkov: Uh, it, it was, um. Probably, yeah, I, so it’s a couple things. Uh, making the first album, um, was the most fun I ever had in my life. It was the, the best, most satisfying, enriching, exciting experience of my life. And, uh, then it was still, you know, COVID and, um, someone a about my age, who is a, a friend of the family suddenly died.[00:40:00]

And that was really, uh, a big turning point too, because I felt like I was, I was making little steps in the right direction. But that death, uh, actually sort of pushed me a lot further into that direction. And it got to the point where I remember clearly, there was one night where, um, I sat down with my parents and I said, I’m gonna be a losing now. I, like I said, you know, in your eyes, maybe I am, I’m not gonna be achieving anything anymore because all I’m gonna do is, is work on the music. And so for a long time it’s not gonna look too good. You know? There won’t be much to talk about. Won’t, won’t be much good news.

Glen Erickson: How old are you at that point, Sammy?

Sammy Volkov: Uh, already too old to be saying that for the first time.

I think. Well now I’m, now I’m 34, so [00:41:00] that was 2020.

Glen Erickson: Yeah,

Sammy Volkov: I don’t know.

Glen Erickson: I only ask ’cause I only ask ’cause Uh uh. But you did accounting but

Sammy Volkov: yeah,

Glen Erickson: um, I only ask ’cause a lot of people wouldn’t necessarily feel like they owed their parents that explanation anywhere past

Sammy Volkov: Well I, I think it was, yeah, I think it was

Glen Erickson: Yeah. I’m curious.

Sammy Volkov: I was back here. I, like, I was, I was, I had left New York ’cause uh. ’cause of COVID and they were asking me to come back to the New York job and I was so torn. I thought, you know, if I go back to this very comfortable life in New York, it will actually probably be a very unhappy one.

Or I could tell them, sorry, I’m not coming back and stay in Edson for a while and keep focusing on music exclusively. And so that, that was really, I think what it was. And that, and that’s why I felt I should explain it because I basically was saying, Hey, can I, can I stay here for a while and stop having [00:42:00] an income?

And, uh, and they of course were not. Of course they luckily were super supportive and always have been. And, um, I found other work and I, I found some freelance stuff. And, uh, around that same time I met my, who, who’s now my, my partner. And, um, we, you know, we got a place together here in Edmonton and, uh. It was the best time of my life.

It fi finally, I was happy all the time and you know, more or less and, uh, I felt like I was doing the right thing and I, yeah, I no longer had this need to check in with external voices and, uh,

Glen Erickson: Yeah, that’s really huge.

Sammy Volkov: validation. Yeah.

Glen Erickson: Yeah, that’s really huge, obviously, to be able to. Have the freedom to have that conversation with your parents. Probably, again, this is an outside observation, but sometimes you [00:43:00] need somebody to have that conversation with, to actually just, uh, validate it for yourself. You know what I mean?

That you’re actually telling yourself, I need permission to do this thing. Sometimes when you’re asking permission of a loved one, you’re really asking permission yourself. I think that’s really huge, uh, especially just in the pursuit of music and the arts. It’s, it’s not a normal career path. It’s not a a degree program, and then you graduate to a set of options.

So it’s so messy and I love how absolutely messy your path seems to be. Like it makes for a great, not in a way that disparage, uh, what you went through in all of that, um, but just it’s such a great illustration of how messy it can be when you’re just willing to chase the thing.

Sammy Volkov: Yeah.

Glen Erickson: keep chasing the thing, um, and not settle for things.

Um, ’cause clearly you would’ve settled on something a lot sooner. [00:44:00] Just like the tension you said about going back to New York, that, you know, a lot of people settle on that tension a lot earlier. Um, especially if things aren’t working out, you know? Um, yeah. And that takes a lot of tenacity, which is pretty adjacent to Audacity.

Keeps creeping back up for you in there, even if you didn’t think it was there. Well, I mean, Sammy, there’s, there’s a couple things I wanna dig into with you if I can really quick, um, and not keep taking up too much time, but I’m so interested about your career and where you’re at. Uh, one of them is a, a bit more just about the genre and how you’re expressing yourself in, in the styles and your song structures and layouts, which isn’t locked in to what I would call retro.

’cause I feel like that’s too. Yeah. Too much of a pejorative now. Um, but, but it’s a, it’s a wide, it’s a wide span, so I get how people maybe use it [00:45:00] sometimes. But before I do that, I just, I wanted to ask you about, ’cause you’ve told me just about your personal journey a little bit here, and it really struck out to me when I was reading some things in your bio when you were talking about just you learning like how to sort of what you were learning inside of pursuing music and your like, and sort of escaping into music and all these things.

And you’ve talked about how these long train rides or these different things that gave you these long opportunities to really just, you know, go inside of yourself to go to work on. On like what do I wanna do? What inspires me to come up with ideas? To refine ideas, which is so much what it is. Right? And I think, ’cause you hear a lot of artists when they talk, who are sort of at the very like career level, like even award-winning, you know, artists talk about the change in their biggest change in their career is how they went from having sort of all that time [00:46:00] and, and that breeding ground of, of ideas and creativity to all of a sudden being in the machinery of a career and a, and a schedule and all these things that all of a sudden remove all of that time.

And how do you stay in that space? So you hear it from that end a lot, but hearing it sort of in your perspective about, you know, where you’re at in your life in that feeding it and then making a change to actually like, dedicate yourself to it. But. In that sort of like exploration, you sort of made a comment in your bio about being a queer kid in the prairies, um, and, and figuring everything out about that and sort of how you belong or where you belong inside of music instead of before you had to sort of figure it out with real people, which I found a really interesting statement.

I guess the question I wanna ask you about that is, a lot of it’s about identity, right? [00:47:00] And I think what’s interesting in music is in a lot of, you know, the way the world would classify it as subsections of, of genre, of music, of all these things. I wanna make sure I put this the right way, so. I, it’s interesting to me how when identity kind of gets forced up into the conversation along with just art and inspiration and you know, what we feel like we’re meant to do, or even if it’s, if it doesn’t have a label of calling on it, just the thing that you’ve already referred to it, the thing that actually truly makes you the happiest.

Like you talked about the happiest days. Not everybody has identity forced into that conversation.

Right. And

so in a very, I don’t equate this the same at all, but I grew up in an extremely religious household, right? So very Christian. The only kind of music I could listen to when I had the burgeoning passion for music and very similar to you in a way, like I was writing songs before I knew, before I had ever sung for anybody, before I knew any instruments.

I, I could [00:48:00] form melodies and words together in my head and, and I wrote them all out on paper. I had a songbook and I knew the melodies in my head type thing. So it was there for me for a very young age, but I was forced to. Keep that inside of this very prescribed box, right? Which was, it had to be Christian music, it had to be gospel music.

If it went outside of that, it’s not just about music anymore, it’s about like everything else, right? Like my entire world view that was being kind of pushed upon me at a young age was being forced into the identity and I didn’t know it right? But the identity of me as a. As an artist, as a musician of the thing that made me the happiest that I knew from a young age would make me the happiest to do the rest of my life was being forced and integrated.

And then when I got a little older into my mid-teen years, I started to also see the pressures of people who pursued this were being forced to carry that identity to everybody else in their [00:49:00] music. If all they wanted to be was a musician, they don’t wanna be a Christian musician. And I became really aware of that by like age 13 only.

And so I, I read a statement like yours, and I often just think empathetically along the lines of, um, people who openly talk about being queer in the arts are somehow it feels like maybe, and this is my perception, so it becomes my question, that they become forced to carry the flag of their identity

Sammy Volkov: Right,

Glen Erickson: in the vehicle of what they’re pursuing in art.

Sammy Volkov: right, right.

Glen Erickson: doesn’t always seem fair, and some people don’t have any problem with it, but I’m just wondering what, having made that statement about, you know, you being able to find, you know, some things that you needed as, uh, just in your own diving into music, um, I’m just wondering how that’s happened for you in all of this.

Like, have you felt [00:50:00] like you’ve had to bring your identity into it? Do you feel like there’s pressure?

Sammy Volkov: Uh, that’s a really good question. Thank you for asking me about that. It’s, um, it’s something I didn’t ever talk about for a very, very long time. And I think it’s probably because it, for me, I didn’t feel it. It mattered, you know? But then as I, as I worked more on music and sang for people more, and when it got to a place where I’d have to sort of, I had to begin to know how to contextualize myself, uh, for other people really. Um, that’s when I began, began to, to feel it. It really did matter. Uh, because how can I, how do I say it? Like, uh, you know, it should go without saying that I, I had like the most privileged life, uh, [00:51:00] you know, my parents could send me to school. I grew up very comfortable as this, this white guy in a, in a affluent kind of, uh, world, but.

At the same time, I did always sort of have this simmering struggle with trying to figure out how I fit in at all. And I didn’t find it with friends. I didn’t find it entirely with, with family when it comes to things like, you know, realizing you’re queer, you know, uh, it, I never heard of any people like me. Um, and I never knew that I was meeting anybody like me because no one talked about it. And so it, I know for sure now it had a, a lot to do with me sort of withdrawing and surrounding myself with musical personalities. [00:52:00] Uh, I’m sure you can tell, I never articulate this, so I don’t really know what I’m saying,

Glen Erickson: No, that’s totally fair.

Sammy Volkov: uh, it’s like, it was like a blessing and a curse.

This discomfort because. It kind of forced me early on to find my own happy places, you know, and like to find my own comfort. And, uh, for me that was, those, those were old records and it, I don’t know, you know, it just, so, it just so happens that a lot of the people who I really idolized, um, of, you know, one off the top of my head is Dusty Springfield.

Dusty Springfield is one of my all time favorite artists and someone I listen to all the time. And, uh, you know, she was a, a gay woman from England and, um, you know, I loved girl group stuff and, uh, it, it [00:53:00] just was always super important to me and that in turn shaped how I make music. And, uh, so I, I feel especially now when things are going in the direction they’re going, you know, in Alberta and obviously in the us I, uh, I have a different mindset now than I used to.

I used to think that, you know, the music can speak for itself and that’s all you need to say. I don’t really think that’s true anymore because I think it’s, I think representation is super important. if I can maybe be an artist that, uh, some other weirdo little kid could listen to and see as an example and sort of connect to, maybe we’ll never meet, but if I could be like a, a comfortable character in their life, you know, that’s really, really, really crucial and really important to me.

And so that’s, uh, that really is like my dream. My, my dream is [00:54:00] to make our. First of all, ’cause I love records, but to make one that will appeal to young people like I was and can be a comfort to them, you know? So I don’t, I don’t, I don’t think it would make any sense for me to leave out my, uh, orientation, whatever you wanna call it. Wherever I am on the spectrum, I, I don’t even really know or, or care. Like I, it, it’s so weird. It’s like, it, it doesn’t matter, but it does. And I, and I still haven’t really figured out how to articulate that, obviously.

Glen Erickson: I don’t know that you have to. More than that, I think, I think the most curious and incredible thing about humanity is being comfortable with opposing ideas and being, we live with them every day, right? Like, or seemingly opposing ideas or, uh, incongruent concepts. Um, you know, that we have that function and ability.

So, yeah. And, [00:55:00] and you know, I, I think that simply by. I, and I like it. I like that we, I identify it more like a spectrum now, because it doesn’t mean you have to plot yourself somewhere. You can just say that it’s not, it’s not a singular, it’s not a graft line. You know? It’s, uh,

Sammy Volkov: it, thank God, you know,

Glen Erickson: yeah, absolutely. Like,

Sammy Volkov: ne it never

Glen Erickson: would do, yeah.

All people ever did was use it to categorize and put people in a box and make them choose how, who is the other. And, and a lot of what you described is that feeling of being made to feel like the other, which, why it becomes so important to, like, I love that you use the term a comfortable character. I think that’s an incredible way to articulate it actually.

That you look for that, you need those, like, and again, my personal experience, like when I say like, I sort of understand this, like this sort of strange like marriage inside of the art of identity with, you know, with [00:56:00] just your love of the art or created creativity, um. But then all these weird ways that it got spun out in, in society and culture, but in, in no way, I wanna make it really clear, really equates with the experience of queer people and what they’ve had to like, I none of that, I had never had to deal with any, any version of external pressure or, or hatred or bigotry or prejudice or any like, so none of none of that really.

Like, because obviously the, the area of the world we’re growing up with made it ridiculously easy for me. But, um, you know, but my pursuit was like, I hated that box and, and my comfortable characters were people that were comfortable saying that they were still at that age, believers, but weren’t, weren’t living inside that box or operating inside of it.

And they were kind of just regular people. Right. And I needed to see those people. So I totally understand what you’re saying. Um. Until [00:57:00] you get a lot older, like where I am now, and have been for quite a while where you achieve some version of enlightenment and, and um, can step outside of all that. Um, but I mean, for you to obviously get to that place, like you said, even with what’s happening in the world right now, I appreciate you saying that too, of, of, um, being willing to accept.

I think it’s unfair when people put that on people, others, right? That to say like, you have a responsibility or as if like, it should make its way even to the lyrics of your songs or things like that, sort of to that level of extremity. But, um, for you to choose to say, um, in a sense just the, the paying it forward, the passing it on to say like, this was my experience when I was young.

Uh, I found myself in that. Like why wouldn’t I? If I get to now make music, why wouldn’t I want to be that same thing for somebody else and maybe give

Sammy Volkov: And well, and you know, it’s, [00:58:00] and it’s not like, uh, it, it’s not like it’s become a, like a branding decision or something, you know, it’s just like,

Glen Erickson: I don’t see that at all. That’s why I was

Sammy Volkov: yeah. It’s just, I just think it’s important to, it’s like, well, if I’m gonna, if I’m gonna write like a, a bio, I mean, what, you know, that is the, that is the time and place to say who you are.

So, so why not say who you actually are? You know, it’s ridiculous to,

Glen Erickson: Well, that’s why it stood out to me, Sammy, because you’re your long bio. Like I’ve, and to be upfront, I’ve read, I couldn’t even count the thousands of bios. I’ve done so many grants and award things from, from the Junos all the way down to like the Edmonton Music Prize and every single thing in between.

Like, um, for, for a long time, for the last like 18 years of my life. I’ve read so many and there’s like lots, you know, there’s lots of sections of your bio that really just are, they read like the sales pitch. Like a lot of us have to like, we have [00:59:00] to, you know, we have to sort of like, here’s my achievements, here’s the things that show that I’m a part of this group of peers, um, to validate, you know, your reason to listen to me or book me for a show or whatever.

So that, that’s always there. But Right plunk in the middle was this paragraph, you know, that was like a quotation of you explaining, you know, yourself. I think that’s really important. I think it was really well written and uh, left me with a lot of curiosity just ’cause I see so often whether people have that pressure or whether they feel like that’s something they have to do or that they feel it’s unfair or whether they feel like, sort of like you said, like I actually want to in this certain way or this version, you know, sort of be something for somebody else.

So,

Sammy Volkov: Was really important to me.

Glen Erickson: Yeah. And it, and it’s important for me to talk about the real reasons because the surfacey way it gets talked about is so disappointing, right? In media, like, like when someone says, well, you [01:00:00] don’t, you don’t look or sound or act queer. So like, why do you feel like you need to talk about it?

Like if, when people say things like that is just such a miss, right? It’s like an absolute like contributing to the problem kind of conversation. So it’s, IM, it’s important I think to say like, why was this a part of who you are and how you got to where you are and what you kind of wanna do now. But um,

Sammy Volkov: I just wanna re I just wanna reiterate real quick that I think it’s, I think it actually is becoming crucial. Like, I, I think that things are going so badly that we’re sliding into, not to get all soapboxy and political, but it, it really is becoming like a scary, scary time. And, uh, you can see clearly how it’s, it’s no longer, uh, gonna be if we’re not, if we’re not really looking out for each other and, and making sure that everybody is safe to be who they wanna be.

Uh, we could very easily continue to slide into a very, very dark place where, um, where you, you can’t be [01:01:00] yourself.

Glen Erickson: Yeah, and you’re right. And it feels like so much work was done by so many people in sacrifice to get to where we thought we were. To suddenly feel threatened that that was. That that’s gonna be made useless or meaningless feels so unfair also for the people who came before and, and, and gave so much to get there.

Um, so I totally agree with you. Um, so here’s the interesting pivot then, uh, the last part I wanna just talk about is like, um, your expression of like a very, I mean, it, it shows up in here, but like the very, like Roy Orison esque at some times, you know, the, the, the very Buddy Holly esque, the, um, I can’t remember the name of the song, sorry.

But it was like your first or second single from this that you had out, that I was listening to and it was very big band, uh,

Sammy Volkov: the Motown one.

Glen Erickson: Yeah, yeah. It was just very, like, I’ve only seen you, so for the record, I’ve also [01:02:00] only seen you at like the Folk Fest tweeners, right? The Raya marches, um, uh, group. And, and so.

The, the minute I heard that song, I was like, this is just so, like, I’m a lot older, so I heard a lot of that music. What’s funny is when I heard music like that, I thought it was so old. Now I realize I was only about fif, I was only about 15 to 20 years removed from that music when I was a kid in the, in the late eighties.

Um, you know, and it felt like forever back for me back then. But, um, but now when I hear that song of yours, I feel it’s very familiar, like the structure of it, the, the, the choices that you make, you know, just the straight time for the snare kind of, you know what I mean? Very forward beat. That’s just, just drive it all the way through and let the horns and the strings and the backgrounds do their work that really sort of carry all the different textures and, and it’s [01:03:00] very familiar and I think that’s what people love, right?

Um. And it becomes a really delicate line to not become super niche because you identify very much with your expression influenced by things that we attach, not a genre like, ’cause you can’t just say it’s like rock metal, hip hop, you know, r and b pop. Like those things span decades too. But when you just use those terms, you think about them in the most modern version quite often.

Whereas people will like quickly spin off the sub genres that are sort of stuck in. Like Buddy Holly era of rock and roll is very different than the Eagles era of rock and roll, which is very different. So, um. I’m just curious how you felt in developing this, you know, and now you’re like into, because you, you made a, a quick caveat.

You, you made like this country-ish record with Dana Wiley, that, that was very cool and got some recognition. So that kind of was like a bit [01:04:00] of a sidestep. Not terribly though. Like, like honestly like Johnny Cash era of country like, was pretty close and sometimes to croner music in the same era of the late fifties and early sixties.

But, um, but even to this new record, when I hear these tracks, um, I’m just curious how you feel about continuing to develop this voice of yours and not just your singing voice, which is very characteristic, but the voice of the whole music. Um. Whether you feel like you don’t give a shit about niche or you don’t think about that you don’t care about how people are gonna slot you in or categorize you, whether that’s limiting or whether you feel there’s opportunity.

I’m just curious what your feelings have been as you’ve like decided to go all out on it.

Sammy Volkov: well that’s a, that’s, I’m glad you asked that. It was cool to, to get to answer that. ’cause um, you [01:05:00] know, uh, sometimes I’ll talk about like influences or whatever, but, but rarely do I get to talk about like, how I approach expressing myself in a way that’s reflective of those influences and like how, you know, how conscious I am of that.

In this case, I gotta say I was 100, literally unconscious because this song came to me in a dream a hundred percent. So, uh, unfortunately. With this song as an example. I can’t actually answer your question because, because I didn’t think about it. I, I had a dream where I was watching someone record in a studio and they were singing the chorus over and over again.

They were trying to conquer the vocal and, uh, get it right. And so I woke up and I was stuck in my head. And, um, so that kind of gave me permission to, like you said, like not care at all about how it’s perceived, because it really feels like I didn’t come up with it. And in that way, the song is really exceptional.[01:06:00]

E every other song on the album, uh, I was much more, um, uh, not careful, but sort of, um, maybe I could put it this way, like with Over the Hardest Part, which is the Motown song you’re talking about. That one I knew it was contrived and I loved that about it. Like I loved the, the fun project of trying to make my version of a Motown record.

And that’s all it was. That’s all I cared about for that song. But all the other songs are, are more nuanced and there’s, there is more thought going into the production and, uh, because I do care how I’m perceived by, you know, um, other music nerds and, uh, I don’t, I don’t wanna be pigeonholed as, uh, as like a tribute artist or like a, a quote unquote retro

Glen Erickson: Yeah.

Sammy Volkov: you know?

So that really does matter to me. Um, so with a song like, uh, uh, blue or, or like, uh, Marjorie or, uh, matter of Time, [01:07:00] the first track on the album, um, those I feel are actually very difficult to categorize, um, because, uh, what influenced me to make those songs, you know, I can’t help but, uh, kind of wear on my sleeve, but the making of the record and the production and the mix and all that, um. To whatever extent I can have an influence on the people who actually work on the production or the mixing or the mastering. You know, in those cases it becomes more technical. Then I am, uh, less sort of laissez-faire about the, like, construction of the song. Like at that point it’s like, okay, this sort of loose, uh, artsy, it’s all about just how it feels moment is sort of passed.

Like that was done with when I wrote the song and sang the song. But when it comes to actually making like a product, I I’m, I am more, uh, intentional and, and less just, uh, uh, you know, [01:08:00] um, free spirited in a way. Uh, so like I’ll, I’ll want it to be apparent to people listening to certain songs that like, oh yeah, that was a bit of Aroy Orbison thing.

But I also want them to think, well, what was that guitar like that that sounded like Wil, you know, so I really want it to be multifaceted. Um, yeah,

Glen Erickson: Well, I mean, your

Sammy Volkov: of my music, I think,

Glen Erickson: your song Blue, if I can, sorry Tammy, that I, I just made me think like I was watching your live performance video that, you know, and you have Alde on it and you have, uh, Connor playing this Jangly guitar, um, which is to the point that you just made. I feel like a lot of people, a lot of people would more fairly, um, get critiqued as pigeonholing or being tribute esque, um, because they’ll literally go down to Nashville to use players that like, can play the way that country was recorded, you know, before it [01:09:00] became pop country.

So they’ll go down and like, play with a certain group of players to get that sound or go to LA to get a certain sound. You know, a Motown sound outta a studio somewhere. Um. You know, to ensure that it happens. I think it’s very different. You know, I, I don’t know if everybody, you know, non-musicians who listen to this, always understand how hard it is to be a solo artist and go into a record and realize you’re putting your faith in the hands of other players, but especially producers, um, and people mixing to believe the vision that you have for it.

And, and to be able to achieve that, like, you’re trusting a lot of people to get the thing to way it is in your head that’s so hard. It’s so hard to do. Um, so for you to achieve those things and those sounds, I think is really, you know, a tip of the hat to obviously your ability to communicate what you wanted and, and also to use people, [01:10:00] very talented people from here.

Rather than run off somewhere else. I think probably, if I’m guessing and maybe you see it the same way, probably go a long way to making sure that it still has an authentic, like this is like a current artist interpreting inspiration rather than just mimicking. Yeah.

Sammy Volkov: Oh, totally. Yeah. That was so important to me. Like I, I, I have nothing against doing like the whole, you know, Nashville experience. Like if you can afford that, that sounds like fun, but you know, it, it also kind of sounds like a nightmare. Or it could be become a nightmare very quickly because you’re, you’re not actually, uh, I don’t feel like you’re doing it for the right reason at that point.

Like, I mean, I would wanna go see those people play, but I don’t know if I wanna try and force myself into that world. Like, I’m much more interested in presenting a slice of like, my life and my world, and, uh, that’s a space in which I can be more honest and more expressive and more relaxed. So if I can feel those ways, then I think people who [01:11:00] hear the music will feel that way too.

Hopefully they can, they can get a glimpse into who I really am and, and like when I’m working with people I like and who I know, then suddenly so much labor is cut out of the equation. I mean, not just like time, but, but like emotionally and expressively. Like I, I can relax with these people and not be afraid of stepping on toes.

You know, I can just actually say what I like and what I want, and I trust them because I know them. And so I’m more open to their ideas and suddenly it’s like, I don’t feel so much of a solo artist because I’m surrounded by people who I’m actually communicating with very openly. So it’s very collaborative and things will go in directions that I didn’t preconceive, uh, thank God, or it would sound very stiff, I think.

And, you know, like, uh, the producer of this album, Renee, Renee slash you know, Renny Wilson, um, you know, uh, that, that was kind of funny. Like he, he was by far the most. Uh, [01:12:00] outsider ish in the process. Like he was the person I knew least, and yet I gave him arguably, like, the most control. And that was because I wanted somebody who wouldn’t necessarily, uh, I wanted like a director, you know, like someone who could be like a director and in a

Glen Erickson: Mm-hmm.

Sammy Volkov: I say that ’cause that’s kind of all I really know about, uh, uh, hierarchy in like a creative process. But, um, you know, I, I didn’t want a friend of mine to produce the album because I was really interested in working with somebody who would come from away, like someone with really outside influences and ideas I thought would enrich my music because I think in this case, the Strongs and, and the songs and my ideas were strong enough that they could dance with that, you know?

Uh, it wouldn’t just be like two buddies in the room. The same wavelength. I [01:13:00] wanted it to sound more, um, uh, kind of unpredictable. Like I wanted to be surprised by, by his ideas. And I was very open to totally like outta left field notions. And, uh, we’d have like some intense conversations. And, uh, that was just a joy to me.

And I think that, uh, yeah, that’s a huge, huge credit to, to Renee. And, uh, one other thing, I, I’m sorry I’m rambling, but like,

Glen Erickson: Sorry.

Sammy Volkov: uh, someone in the, in the album who’s super essential, not everyone is, but, um, Cassia Hardy, who, uh, for a long time was the leader of the Edmondson Band wears. Um, I had become friends with her and I, I sought her out.

Uh, as my creative partner in this album because of her incredible, like natural leadership, uh, and strength in musical [01:14:00] ideas. And also because our music is nearly polar opposite. It’s like really badass, hard driving punk in cascia’s world and like lilting, crony, twee old man music a lot of the time for me.

And so together, I thought it made a really interesting, uh, kind of very much stronger sort of structure than if I had just worked in my comfort zone all the time, you know? So, yeah. Uh, I don’t even know what your question was anymore ’cause I just

Glen Erickson: No, that’s, that’s the experience though. Um, that’s what you’re explaining, at least the experience somewhere like, I guess what’s interesting to me in there, Sammy, is that underneath all that, what you expressed in there in your choice of producer and the choice to work with somebody who’s so opposite, I just think what’s interesting is there’s such a confidence in that, and I think it just goes back to what you were saying at the very beginning is like, um, you know, I asked you about [01:15:00] Audacity and you said, no, that’s not my natural, like, this isn’t a natural characteristic.

This is a thing that comes outta me in music. You know, and it, it just seems so common in all of your stories so far. You know that when it comes to music in your life, you have this confidence, this confidence to believe in your songs or your vision. This

Sammy Volkov: Yeah, but we’re talking about music.

Glen Erickson: That’s what I mean is that, um, you know, I, I guess what I, the reason I’m pointing it out is I sometimes can’t find a proper way to explain to people who just aren’t musicians.

Like, why it is such a powerful force. Like, there’s people, I’ve heard lots of people who aren’t musicians or creatives talk about the power of music in their life and how, uh, how it does the things it does, and the impact it can have from, you know, in, in bringing back incredible memories to the way it, it moves us to like, make big decisions in our life and all that stuff.

But from the inside it’s so hard to [01:16:00] articulate the power of it. And so you’re, you’ve essentially articulated through your entire story that like there’s one way in your life that you are able to sort of express the confidence in who you are, you know? Um. To have audacity to like know what you wanted to do to bring people in who are complete opposites of you, and still trust that it’s gonna be the right choice and the right thing, uh, that you’d even have the ability to trust them in the first place is built on this common shared love of music and what it can do if, if you can align yourselves around it.

Um, which is like, I think just with the beauty of so much of, you know, these pursuits and, and these efforts that we make, whether they just be vanity projects or, or so we think sometimes, and then they turn into, you know, an actual path forward finally for us, which, you know, is what it sounds like so much in your career to this point.

So, so [01:17:00] you have a record that’s coming out officially this week. Um, you have a bunch of tour dates that follow it, which, uh, you know, we’ll have links in the things we put out here for people I hope. If people are along the dotted line of those shows, get a chance to get out and uh, and see and hear you.

Do you, do you find that you have, I guess this is my last question, um, just ’cause it maybe dovetails when I’m talking about your tour dates and what I talked to you before about, um, your chosen, how you express your music in, in the different genre crossing. Do you have a really varied audience? Do you have a lot of different demographics and, and even decades, uh, represented, uh, in people as a result?

Does it actually sort of show itself in, you know, pretty wide, pretty wide range?

Sammy Volkov: Yeah. Yeah. I’m, I’m glad you asked that. Yeah. It’s like, [01:18:00] uh, you know, I’ve only very, uh, really seriously been pursuing performing my music since like. 2020, but there wasn’t much going on then. So it’s taken a long time to, uh, begin to see like patterns and to even, to even be around long enough to have anyone come to my shows.

But, um, it, it’s funny, I was thinking about that just, uh, a day or two ago as I invite people to come to shows. It’s, it’s, it’s pretty funny the people I’m writing to because it’s like, there’s like, uh, really young, kind of like, uh, indie punky people and then there’s like people who are so old, like, I hope they know how to respond to my email and like everyone in between.

So,

Glen Erickson: Yeah.

Sammy Volkov: but it, it’s, that makes me really happy. ’cause it, I think that, you know, there’s, there’s different stuff in the different songs to appeal to all sorts of different people. You know, like there’s a, there might be like a Motown song, there might be like a country crooner song, and then there might be like a Neil Young [01:19:00] song and then for whatever reason there’s like a. A buck like Wilco thing. So it’s like it’s all over the place and, um, that’s really, uh, stimulating to me. And, and, uh, yeah, I, I think I’m gonna keep going in that direction. Like, I, I love the eclecticism that I’m allowed to kind of play with in a show and, uh, it’s just, it’s more fun that way. And yeah, so it’s pretty cool when I see like, uh, a, a table of some super young folks decide like, uh, the 85-year-old couple from Calgary who, who are like long tire CKUA supporters, you know, um, it makes me really happy that those, those people can be in the same room and, and both enjoy the music.

So, uh, yeah, it’s really fun.

Glen Erickson: That’s awesome. Well, I mean, it’s been a real treat to talk to you, Sammy. I appreciate you being really open about your story. And I, at one point in the middle you [01:20:00] said, this is probably really boring, and it’s literally the opposite. I find it really interesting. I’m glad I asked you to stop and explain.

Um, and then we got to, you know, unpack all of that stuff. And I, I think it’s really great. Uh, I appreciate you taking the time to tell the story. I am really interested to continue to see, you know, what, what comes next. Like, a lot happens and, and a record creates a whole new set of opportunities and, and, um.

Challenges too as an artist. Um, and the challenge always to keep going. So, um, just looking forward to seeing more. I hope people take the chance to get out and, and see you play when they can and go and listen to the new record and the new songs. And a lot of them are already, if they go to YouTube, you’ve done a number of the tracks up there for people to listen to.

And I encourage them all to go and check out the Sammy Volkov Library. But thanks so much for your time. Appreciate it.

Sammy Volkov: thank you so much, Glen. I I [01:21:00] really appreciate you taking the time to really listen and to talk to someone who’s, uh, you know, I feel like I’m, uh, I’m pretty green and you talk to some pretty badass people, so thanks for taking the time to take me seriously.

Glen Erickson: I, well, I, yeah, absolutely. I appreciate that. And it’s important to me. You know, I, I chose the premise of doing this to talk about what the journey looks like and 20 years in 10 records in has a certain perspective and. But the people too records in at, you know, in today’s day and age, have an equally important voice.

So, um, uh, yeah. So I just really appreciate you being articulate and, and willing to be vulnerable and talk about it all. So it’s great. It’s what makes the thing go round. So, yeah. We’ll, we’ll hopefully see you around and talk again soon.

Sammy Volkov: For sure. Yeah. Thank you so much.

Glen Erickson: Yeah.

[01:22:00]

 

Alexi and Glen: Ready,

you are born ready. Okay. Welcome to

part two.

I like to prefer to call it letter B.

Oh,

this is episode 36 post fame BB,

um, for all my viewers at home, we basically just had a 24 minute ripper of a session. Um, I’d say honestly. In terms of how funny I was in it, probably top four episodes that we’ve recorded.

Top

four outta 36. Yeah. Which is a theme of our ripper.

Yes.

Landing on why number 36. Seemed like a big reveal to you and

felt like a big number to me. Um,

56 also figured prominently.

Yep. That one’s gonna be a banger. We don’t know why yet. But that is, uh, for us to stay tuned. Um,

I have until 46 to get my act together.

Get your act together

and tighten up

stuff. The Junos are happening, which are the Canadian Grammys. We’ve went over that entire list, but maybe we’ll

ran over the whole list and

maybe we’ll throw in a new little skip it. Bit [01:23:00] one, one little cheeky post fame plus in the middle of a season about it.

Maybe.

I mean, we still have a couple weeks to talk about it again if we want to. This is

true.

Um, actually might be more appropriate after next week’s

True

guest.

And we also talked about a lot of stuff at the start, but it was. Honestly all yap.

There was a lot of Yap.

Yeah, it’s very

true.

There was like a good 10 minutes.

Yap. So that was my Ted Talk version of the 24 minute episode that we just failed to have.

But it’s important that we do capture a good conversation. And for your viewers at home, for Lexi’s viewers at home, I think I just did a couple things differently that I didn’t think would matter and then. I just checked all the audio and it was screwed up.

So all the information nobody needed to hear, they’re like, why don’t you just get to it? So, um,

you didn’t tell me He’s kind of cute.

What?

Sorry? I just didn’t know what he looked like and I was You didn’t know what sounded supposedly surprised. [01:24:00]

You just looked it up right now.

Good for him.

That’s funny.

That’s so funny though.

Uh, I hopefully he doesn’t listen to this and I hope my boyfriend doesn’t listen

to this. He sings classic tunes.

Good for him.

Yeah. So. You did write some notes?

Yeah.

Despite, uh, uh, a zero point fiasco on the train.

Oh, where

you,

that was the other thing that happened. I

did, I was melted down on text to me about absolutely nothing and just ended it with an LOL.

Yeah.

But for

all the times I said I’m just a girl. That was the biggest

moment. Yeah. Okay. But. Anyhow. So the things were there for you to listen to and you didn’t think they were, but they were.

And yet I prevailed

and you listened, and then you had an interesting point to make about something you wished we had talked more about, which is almost never the case.

I know, I know. Shocking discovery. Um, yeah. I feel like it’s, you know, this is a weird episode now because I feel like I’m repeating myself, but I’m not. You’re, [01:25:00] um, yeah. What I had said is that, um, I. There’s a section where you two are talking about his job in LA where he had to drive around quite a bit. Um,

Greenpeace.

Greenpeace. And he would pick an artist in the morning and that’s the artist he would listen to for that day. And then when he was done his job, he’d go home and try to write a song in that style. And how, I thought that was just so. Interesting. And what I said, and I’ll say it again, is like there’s been a lot of artists that we’ve had on or that we’ve heard, and when they talk about like the ways they inspire themselves or get themselves to write or practice, you know, a lot of them say just like kind of the same things in different fonts.

And this kind of felt like a little bit [01:26:00] unique. We said that boy Golden had done a similar thing where he made himself write every day.

Yeah.

His journaling style, style, his

journal of style.

Um, and I kind of like that, like we were talking about, the forced kind of structure, but you really, you don’t see it a lot in a lot of artists.

And him also getting super niche with it and just how I imagine difficult that practice would be and committing to it every day. Um. Very cool.

Yeah. I mean, when you think about it, right, like the idea of I’m gonna write, it’s one thing to go home and just say, I’m gonna learn a song from this person.

’cause I’ve gone through phases where, oh yeah, like I’m gonna learn this song that I always want to be able to play on my guitar by Bon Air. And then I’m gonna learn this song, you know, yeah. From Death Cab, or I’m gonna do something or another. Um, but then to take that to the degree of like. I’m going to be listening to the music so much on these long commutes that I’m studying, [01:27:00] what they’re doing with song structure and what makes them a little different from other things.

So you have to pick up on the nuances and then to go back and try to recreate the nuances in a song.

Yeah. Like subtle flex by him, not on purpose.

Yeah. There’s a

lot like that takes a lot of skill to like

to it.

You know, listen for one day and then pull all those like incy in.

Yeah.

Intricacies, intricacies out.

Yeah.

There’s a song I mentioned to him, I forget the title off the top of my head right now, but from his new record that, um, it felt like, it felt like a little Motown, a little big band, a little, you know, seventies stuff happening. But it, what I really like is I, I don’t like it when people just try to sort of like.

Um, what’s the, I, I’m struggling for the right word, but just mimic a genre so it feels almost [01:28:00] copycat and almost kitsch. Almost goofy. Yeah. But then there’s someone who just does it and it sounds not just like somebody from now trying Tom Music that sounded from then, but it sounds like somebody who’s like literally allowing the full inspiration of music from then to come in now.

But it’s still for now.

Yeah.

Right. It still feels now-ish. You know, that’s like,

it’s like the true meaning of like inspired by

Yeah.

And I, it’s like I’m not trying to copycat, I’m like, you know, you’re pulling just the right things for like now.

Yeah. And you know, Sammy’s like early in his career and I think there’s like so much that he’s capable of doing.

And I’m not saying like this Motown song was like perfect. It was really good. But it definitely showed me what that ability was.

Yeah.

And uh, I thought it was very, very cool.

Sound like an American Idol judge.

I think.

Yeah. I expanded your taste. It really showed me what you were capable of tonight.

Well, it’s a missed [01:29:00] opportunity that they never tapped me on the shoulder for that job, but

seriously.

Um, anyway, I think that that was a good point. Um. And you had sort of made a point, which for me was one of the things that was big on the conversation, which is like

timeline,

the timeline meandering and just getting a chance to like say like, wait a minute. And when I like stopped for a second to ask him to explain how he got from, you know, his storyline from 13 years old Edmonton to what seems like a young adult in LA with an agent.

You know, working for Greenpeace. Yeah. And find out that there’s New York and Toronto and LA and

Yeah.

All around, multiple times together. In between all of that happening before he even recorded his first record,

which I love,

um, was, and I think what was sweet about it was he thought that it was boring, which is why he was skipping it.

And I’m like,

not the case.

This is, this is [01:30:00] interesting. It says so much, there’s so much that it says about. About you and the way that, uh, that you kind of chased this around. So anyhow, I thought, oh, that was really cool. A good episode to, I just liked, I liked talking to somebody who’s, you know, when you’re early, there’s a different version of trying to evaluate what’s happening.

Mm-hmm. Then when you’re 20 years down the road and you’re evaluating

in hindsight

what’s happened primarily

Yeah.

Not what’s happening. Yeah. So you just get a different taste and that’s, uh, why it’s important for me to have

these conversations,

have all of them cover the spectrum.

Yeah.

So, anyhow. Okay.

Thanks for recovering. With me getting another eight minute episode in, it’s fantastic.

I would stay up past my bedtime just for you.

Appreciate it. I’m gonna be staying up past my bedtime to finish.

That’s late.

Boom. That’s very late. Okay. Thank [01:31:00] you.

Okay. Good night for a second

time. Good night.